Men think women are difficult creatures that they don’t know what goes on in their heads but to us women men are just as difficult to make sense of at the best of times. For example, after a date why haven’t they called? If they like us how will they make it known and how some of us (I being a prime example) do, more often than not, end up banished to the dreaded friend’s zone.
I therefore decided to take on this real subject myself. It all started on a random Wednesday afternoon when a bunch of girls on twitter and I were discussing what men ‘actually wanted’ and how we know what is going on in their heads. How could we even know? Men are not ones to express their opinions or feelings very easily. Hence we compiled a list of questions which I sent to some willing volunteers: one British Asian musical celebrity, an American, Australian, Indian and Pakistani and some lovely gentlemen I have met through Twitter. I wanted to address some issues which affect us women.
I’d like to thank the people who have chosen to be named for taking part in this research. That is Navin Kundra, Shai Hussain,Shamik M, Harry Key, Jay Karsandas, Harsh, Joseph Brennan, Gee Singh , Ronak Kataria, and Zeeshan Khan. Also KJ, KP and NK who have chosen to be identified by initials only.
This post was originally almost 9k words long so if you would like a full version of the article, which includes two extra questions, please drop me an email on firstname.lastname@example.org .
I started off by asking “What kind of guy are you?”
KJ – Hard working and outgoing. Able to balance his life so all areas flourish; love life, work, and family. I’m also quite a homely person yet still enjoy travelling and discovering new places.
NK – A tall, dark and handsome stud muffin who will sweep a girl off her feet and be there to catch her when she falls deeply in love with me! (Laughs!) No really…I’m being serious! (Laughs again!)…or maybe I’m just a muffin!
ZK – Intelligent, Caring, Witty, Friendly.
JK – You’re either a man or a boy. Man = Secure, independent, classy, with a bit of etiquette. Boy = Immature, insecure, relies on his mommy and still plays Xbox daily. I put myself in the Man category.
SM – Independent, career focussed, bit of a clown at times. Sensitive. Love to laugh, keep busy and try new things.
RK – Intelligent, very up to date on current affairs, a mixture of homely and outgoing. Happy going out to a bar, cinema, exhibition or just at home take away and watching a movie.
SH – Independent, free-thinking, arty in a commercial sense, a combination of traditional and western lifestyle. I don’t like football or beer, so people have thought me to be metro sexual. Or gay. Or a woman.
HN – I would say independent. Being a hardcore traveller and explorer; a bit sensitive.
HK – I’d be inclined to describe myself favourably. I’m of above average intelligence, which helps me be funny (at times, except now, when I’m expected to back up that claim with proof). I’m tall, Australian and incredibly forgetful. I’m very outgoing and intentionally insensitive.
JB – I would describe myself as intelligent, humorous, unique, funny, and loving.
GS – I would probably describe myself as a self confident, motivated and intelligent person. Who is outgoing but equally at home with the family and has an addictive personality.
KP – I’m an intelligent lad.
What’s the most attractive and most unattractive thing in a woman for you?
KJ – Most attractive = Eyes. Least attractive = Too much facial hair.
NK – Confidence is most attractive – when she’s comfortable in her own skin. Arrogance is the most unattractive thing in a woman, there’s a fine line between confidence and arrogance.
ZK – Most attractive: intelligence and sense of humour, Most unattractive: Temper, Pride and Flaunting.
JK – Independence and the attitude of “I don’t need a man, but if you’re there then all the better, we can roll with that”. Clingy, insecure women without some wit and backchat just bore me to death. Have that little bit of edge about you, that extra bit of class and ambition about yourself. Now that’s attractive.
SM – Don’t like “rude girls”, someone who is intelligent is attractive, someone who can hold a conversation and likes banter.
RK – Attractive – height, intelligence, independence. HAS to be clever/clued up, hate bimbos that have no clue about the world. Ignorance is my pet hate. Unattractive – As said above. People who just watch shows like Big Brother/Made in Chelsea etc.
SH – Attractive – confidence, charm, humour, independent thought to do what she feels is right rather than what she is taught to believe, consideration, romantic gestures, effort. Sexiness is great, but in a relationship, cuteness rules supreme. Unattractive – ego, rudeness, intolerance, narrow-mindedness, over flirtation, lack of hygiene, bad manners, lack of self-respect and respect for others, heartlessness, limited interests, no sense of humour or adventure.
HN: Most attractive point I would say is her eyes. Most unattractive thing: bad nails.
HK – Most attractive quality in a woman would probably be confidence and laugh. Least attractive? Really drunk or apparently slutty would be my least favourite traits.
JB – The most attractive thing is feminine beauty. Most unattractive is lack of intelligence.
GS – Most attractive: the experience when I first meet them. Most unattractive thing is someone who actually believes they are better than you.
KP – Most attractive has to be her eyes and smile. Ambition is a must once you get to know that person and if she is a keeper!
Do men give out any signs during the date?
KJ – paying lots of attention and making her laugh. If I wasn’t interested, there wouldn’t be any humour but lots of silent moments.
RK – Body signals, am I leaning towards you, do I touch your hand when you are passing something, when walking; am I close to you? I like you – a confident guy would play it cocky and try to make you laugh. He would hold eye contact when talking to you and touch you whenever he gets the opportunity. He’d also try and work his way into snogging you one way or another. A guy with less confidence (which is where I usually come from) will try compliment you and look for the perfect moment to touch you, even hold your hand, but will get nervous almost immediately and panic, leading to verbal diarrhoea of nothingness – anything to get away from the awkward silence he feels that he’s just created for himself. This is usually the bit where the girl thinks she’s dating a freak and leaves. But yes, if touch, humour or sweaty palms are there, he’s definitely into you.
HK – Whether I discuss anything in the future will be a good sign of my future intentions. If I’m planning another date or saying ‘we should go do X sometime’ will usually be a positive indicator. But, sometimes guy’s give off these signs if I’m aiming for sex.
GS – Yes definitely, if it’s not happening most men won’t talk about the long term, relationships, family etc also they won’t want to stick around.
KP – We can say rude things if we don’t like the girl: even on a first date.
How do you make it known, after you have been on a date that you’re not interested?
NK – Eat lots of garlic and onions…she won’t want to be anywhere near you. That way, it’s her decision, not yours! (Winks).
KJ – I would personally not say anything after just one date. Let it settle and maybe after a few dates, after I’ve got to know her a little better, I’ll be in a better position to decide.
ZK – Stop staying in touch – avoiding!
JK – This is not an easy one, no one likes to get rejected. I simply don’t lead the girl on after, flirting by text and calling like some may do. It’s not a game to boost your ego so if you’re not interested you should just make it damn well clear. Turn the tables for a moment, you wouldn’t like someone doing it to you, would you?
RK – I always say we should be mates, that’s probably a cop out for a lot of men, should be more honest.
SH – This has only ever happened to me the once, and I’m not very happy about the way I dealt it. I’d usually avoid picking up the calls, and when I would, I’d sound really uninterested and make up lame excuses about work being really busy. Guys can be busy, but if they don’t offer an alternative date, know that this is them blowing you off.
Let’s flip the scenario: when you go on a date and you are interested, how do you make it known?
KJ – Make her laugh, joke about there being “the next time”. Tell her she’s beautiful and after that date, let her know you’d love to see her again.
ZK – Start asking personal questions, get more philosophical; get their outlook on life and marriage in general – the whole visualisation concept!
JK – Ah, now there is no need to jump into it straight away and tell her your undying love. Women are complex; I’m still trying to work them out myself. If she knows you like her on the first date, you might as well kill off all anticipation. Build on it, I like to be a bit playful, have fun and not ask her interview questions. This is a date, no arranged marriage interview, so I tend to try and get to know her beyond those questions.
RK – Wait a couple of days after the date, stupid thing about not seeming too keen, drop a text, call later and then ask if you would like to meet again. I would not say I like you after a first date.
HK – If I’m interested, I’ll usually make it pretty obvious and explicit “I think you’re interesting and funny and hot, I’d like to see you again, and often – how about you?”
JB – Make eye contact, listen fully to what she says in conversation, suggest another date and contacts her after the date.
GS – I would really take an interest and keep the conversation flowing, there is no rush and nothing will detract from that person, but I also feel it’s important to let the other person know how things are and what you expect out of everything to see if things match.
Men take ages to text after a date and that’s a major issue for us women. How long do you wait to text the girl after the date?
KJ – I would test straight after the first date, and I would personally ensure she reached home safely by dropping her off myself, regardless of where she lives. I’m not one to waste time with anyone; hence I would say things straight away rather than waiting around.
NK – I think it’s important to be a gentleman and at least check that she reached home safe after a date – it’s also a really good way of saying goodnight.
JK – Girls don’t take it seriously if he doesn’t text that night. Being a gentleman doesn’t mean texting that night if she got home safe, he could also be a bit ‘to keen’ to text straight away. Some guys play games, some play the game. So take it as it comes, if he likes you he’ll contact you.
RK – An unwritten rule for me and my mates is 3 days after you meet before first contact, after first date 2 days, 2nd date, around 24 hours. Though this excludes then, text me to say you got home safely if you are not dropping them.
SH – I don’t usually go with the ‘rules’ – if I liked her, I’d most likely text her on the way to work the next morning.
HK – If I think she may have had a journey home worth worrying about (anything on public transport) I’ll message that evening (or take her close to home myself). The next text will be whenever a reason to text occurs to me. If you’ve mentioned a big interview or pitch, I might text before it. If I’m not thinking about you much, it’ll take longer. If I fancy her I’ll message the next day, if I really fancy her I might restrain myself and try to wait a day longer.
JB – Good chance I would text that evening, but definitely by the next day.
GS – The problem is text to soon and women think your too eager and text too late and they think you’re an idiot, I tend to text the next day or after a few hours but it’s a judgement call depending on how things go.
Why do so many men leave it ages to tell a girl that they don’t think it is working out?
KJ – My own view is that many men look at the benefits they are getting and if that situation is ok for them for now. The girl may be looking for love and would be getting attached, whereas the man may just let it be and is happy to move along.
NK – I think saying ‘no’ or ‘it’s not working’ is a hard thing to say in any situation, especially if you genuinely care for that person and don’t want to hurt their feelings. You have to be honest with yourself and with your partner, the sooner…the better. Remember…garlic and onions can always assist!
SM – afraid of hurting feelings/ or one of those that lead a girl on/ maybe they don’t know how to say it.
RK – Scared, don’t know how to tell her, men prefer to hide from it thinking it will go away. But sometimes we are not sure and need that 2nd date to find out!
HK – Aside from the double negative, it assumes that women don’t do the same thing!!! Women do, and for the same reason: It’s easier to avoid the angst of breaking someone’s heart; it allows us to maintain a delusion that we’re a good person. Women will often not dump a guy until she’s got another guy in her sights (a natural biological effect of being the female of the species), while men will bear a bad relationship because it terrifies us to make you cry at us and we hate that (but when we do break up, it’s usually to be ‘single’ which is guy-speak for playing the field).
KP – Believe it or not we don’t like girls to think we are pricks lol. We would rather not say anything and let the girl take a hint that way we are not at fault. Also I think every man when dating women think they can do better but at the same time don’t want to close off what they have and perhaps save it for a rainy day.
What are your views on women asking men out?
KJ – My own fiancé practically asked me out for our first date! I think it’s great, and it should be whoever acts first should ask the other person out, regardless of whether you’re a man or woman. Past experience is that the man has to make his feelings known, and the woman doesn’t know what to do or say, even though the feeling is mutual. I say act on your feelings, without playing the chase.
NK – Women asking men out is sexy! That shows interest, confidence, humility and passion. As a guy I would be flattered to have a beautiful woman come up to me and ask me out.
ZK – It’s something that sounds unusual but not anymore, I guess men also like attention yet at the same time they love the chase as it’s extremely challenging!
JK – Women asking men out is cool. We’re in the modern age, no? Men love the chase. They chase the girl, but make it seem to the girl that she is doing the chasing.
SM – I think they should – Destiny’s Child didn’t release independent women for no reason!! I don’t mind the chase but it’s nice to see a proactive girl trying their luck also!
RK – I would find it strange, but kind of nice too. Though you are right, I love the chase, love seeing if can get a girl. Sad but a lot of men do too. All an ego boost.
SH – Men do NOT always love the chase. I hated it. I waited and waited for the day when women might ask me out (didn’t you learn anything from Sex and the City!?) but eventually, I knew I had to man up and get out there. The whole ‘playing hard to get thing’ is a huge turn-off for me.
HN – I will be more than delighted if it starts happening. I don’t know why girls don’t do. I have seen many girls who are dying to go out with my friends, or maybe me, they will give all kind of signs but never out rightly ask out for a date. I feel it’s cool for a girl to ask out for a date to a guy… super cool!
HK – If women want equal rights for equal pay, the right to vote and the right to live your life as an equal, then take up some of the more onerous burdens. Ask a guy out. Make the first move. Pay for a drink. Simple. Welcome to liberation, women.
GS – I don’t think it’s a bad thing, but I think the chase means they appreciate you because they had to work hard.
How do you think that people avoid ending up in the friend’s zone?
KJ – If you like him too much, it’s either better to not be friends at all, or accept that you’ll have to be friends.
JK – If you don’t want to be in the friend zone, simple… don’t act like a friend.
SH – I reckon quarter of the girls on my facebook are girls that I’ve liked who’ve ended up in the friend zone with me. As I said in my last answer, all girls need to do is be honest. If you like him, tell him. If he doesn’t take the bait, at least he knows – and on a later date, when he knows that you like him, and he’s actually had a good think about “Pyaar dosti hain, love is friendship, what a wonderful thought!” you’ve got him on a plate.
HK – I will drop bits of innuendo and generally make it clear in an ‘I’m joking about the truth’ kind of way, and then wait for (or engineer) a circumstance where she can get a bit tipsy (NOT drunk) and we can sit on a couch and talk. If things are going well, we may end up kissing. To avoid going there in the first place is simple: Ask him out. It’s not easy, and the first few times (or with people you really like) it’s not fun, but it a necessary part of dating life. Like visiting the dentist.
JB – Men usually label a woman a friend if they aren’t attracted/interested in her, or if they fancy her, but want to get to know her without revealing they fancy her.
KP – Make it clear from the start what you are looking for and if you don’t like them romantically then let’s not waste each other’s time
Beauty or brains?
KJ – Brains. If she isn’t able to command a decent job and take care of herself, then the future isn’t orange..
NK – Both…failing that, just plain naughty!
JK – Is it too much to ask for both? I think not. Each complements each other perfectly.
SM – Bit of both in my eyes! But they don’t have to be the prettiest girls on the planet by any means, connection is most important! She is not going to look like that forever and neither am I! Why have a woman that you can’t talk to and just gawk at?
SH -Playing around – beauty. Relationship material – definitely brains. But the relationship would never work without even the slightest attraction (though beauty lies in the eye of the beholder).
HN: Brains any time…
HK – Both. I’m greedy and have discovered that both can exist in equal quantities, you’ve just got to be worth it. The obvious point is that unless she’s sexually appealing, I won’t really get interested, but unless she’s funny, intelligent and socially competent, I won’t stay interested.
JB – Beauty and brains? Definitely, brains must be a factor.
GS – I need to be physically and mentally attracted for it to work otherwise it’s not going to work.
KP – Let’s be completely honest here. No-one wants to date ugly person- simples. So long as you find that person attractive then it’s all about the brains from there on in.
I guess the purpose of this blog post was to gain an insight into mens minds and what they think, and I don’t think any of these answers differ to each other……much. This therefore leads me to believe that this post will help some of the ladies in some way or another.
Women should ask men out. If you don’t want to remain in the friend’s zone then don’t act like a friend.
Now, I don’t believe that men only go for brains so as well as making yourself look pretty before a date make sure you are clued up on news events etc so as to have interesting discussion points.
Everything else is pretty much common sense. If he contacts you, if he asks you out again, if he appears interested during a date and arranges another – he is into you. If he takes ages to contact you, doesn’t contact you at all, appear disinterested or cuts a date short – he’s just not that into you.
But men, remember, don’t play games. If you like a girl: tell her or ask her out and keep in contact. Women, if you like a guy tell him. Because if you don’t – then someone else will.
Let me know what you think..